‘Revolution’ meeting in Istanbul: ‘We know we will face a crisis in Turkey; revolutions coincide with crises’

The new book "Revolution" by Communist Party of Turkey (TKP) General Secretary Kemal Okuyan, released last August by Yazılama Publishing and having reached its 5th printing due to high demand, is meeting with readers at discussion and book-signing events in Izmir, Istanbul, and Ankara, respectively.

The meetings, which began in Izmir under the title ‘How will we bring the country together with revolution?’, continued on Sunday with an event held at the Cemil Candaş Cultural Center in Şişli, Istanbul. The event drew significant interest from citizens.

Responding to numerous questions at the event, Okuyan emphasized that the crisis of governance in Turkey could transform into a systemic crisis. He stated, "When we look at Turkey, we know that we will face a major crisis, perhaps not immediately, but maybe in 5 years or even 5 months. Revolutions coincide with crises. How will this crisis deepen in Turkey? What could cause those at the top to become unable to govern any longer? You must ponder these questions. You should not postpone the idea of revolution to a period when the revolution is already on the rise."

Stating that Turkey is one of the countries closest to a revolution, Okuyan said, "Turkey is not only pregnant with a revolution, but it also possesses the resources to carry that revolution to victory. Turkey is a country that can sustain itself. Therefore, there is no reason to be hopeless."

‘Revolution is no longer on the agenda of the Turkish left’

TKP General Secretary Okuyan answered questions directed at him during the event. Regarding a question about the stage-based revolution strategy, which was debated for a long time within the Turkish socialist movement, Okuyan said, "Staged revolution was a topic debated by all leftists in Turkey in the past. Is the revolution on Turkey's agenda a democratic revolution, a national revolution, or a socialist revolution? This debate was held extensively, and it is good that it was. Today, this discussion has receded into the background, and I do not think this is a positive development. The past debate was very detailed, but our problem today is that the nature and character of the revolution have been pushed aside because the proportion of those aiming for revolution has decreased significantly. The Turkish left no longer talks about revolution. Once it left the agenda of the left, it also began to disappear from the agenda of society, and this is not a good thing." 

What kind of revolution will it be? Will it be a bourgeois democratic revolution led by the working class? In no country in the world can any revolution be a democratic revolution. The capitalist class, which dominates the world today, had a progressive character at certain points. That period has completely closed. From now on, if we are to speak of a real revolution in a country, it can only be a socialist revolution. 

It is impossible for any capital group to lead anything beneficial in this country. We must know that the capitalist class is a class that is an enemy of the people all over the world," he replied. 

‘They tried very hard to turn Gezi into a liberal movement, but they failed’

Responding to the question, "Can color revolutions be studied as a revolutionary process?" TKP General Secretary Okuyan replied: "What is a color revolution? In reality, they do not create color revolutions out of thin air. They shape a country by exploiting public discontent. The Arab Spring, for example, is a color revolution. The events in Ukraine in 2014 were also a color revolution. Revolutions emerge on their own anyway. Anger accumulates in society, the public becomes mobilized, and at that moment, others who want to use the mobilized public for their own interests step in. Throughout history, others have tried to influence all revolutions. It is not just us revolutionaries who try to steer revolutions. Others also try to steer those revolutions to ensure they result in outcomes that suit their own goals. A revolution took place in Russia in 1905, but that revolution failed. At that time, there was a war between Japan and Russia. Japan began to secretly support the Russian revolutionaries. But the 1905 revolution did not become a Japanese revolution; the Russians had their own problems, and the Japanese wanted to take advantage of them but failed." 

Revolutions are chaos; everyone tries to steer them. Revolutions are periods when revolutionaries must prepare well in advance and do their duty properly so that others do not benefit from the anger of the working people. If you do not do your job, other forces will seize the revolutions. 

The June Resistance was like this. Other forces wanted to take advantage of this popular movement. If millions take to the streets, some will try to seize control. Gezi did not allow this. The US and the EU tried it. The public that took to the streets at that time was patriotic and freedom-loving. That is why a color revolution did not emerge from there. They tried very hard to turn Gezi into a liberal movement, but they failed." 

‘When revolutions emerge, all forces in that country go into action’

Kemal Okuyan responded to a question about how the interaction between a socialism-oriented working class and different currents can affect revolutionary processes: "Revolutions do not emerge from the decisions of a few people. When revolutions emerge, all forces in that country go into action. Some become counter-revolutionary, while others want to exert their influence. There are intermediate colors, and new balances emerge. There are gray periods here. Venezuela is a typical example. In Venezuela, an independence-oriented movement emerged against the US. It included communists, social democrats, and a figure like Chavez emerged. If a revolution does not evolve into its logical conclusion, it regresses. Venezuela did not transition to socialism in the way we understand it. A hybrid country emerged. This cannot be permanent. That is why Venezuela is regressing. No revolution starts by saying, 'We will establish socialism.' There is an uprising, and the country's communist party tries to link the revolutionary rise to a socialist revolution. In the end, either socialism wins or the counter-revolution wins. The preparations made during these periods when the revolution is not rising are extremely important for the working class to exert its weight during the revolution. If you are not well prepared, someone else will take it and run."

‘There is no revolution without darkness’

Answering the question, "How can it be possible to make a revolutionary organization ready in Turkey?" Okuyan stated: "When you live in a dark period, you find hope if you know when and how revolutions emerge. Throughout history, revolutions have emerged at the moments when those societies were most hopeless. They have even emerged during periods when even revolutionaries lost hope in their country. In fact, there is no revolution without darkness. Why would a happy and content society make a revolution? When it is dark, people face the truth. There is darkness and crisis in Turkey. A normal person, an unorganized person, says in this picture, 'The AKP does whatever it wants.' But an organized person says, 'They cannot govern.' Crises of the system can follow crises of governance. When we look at Turkey, we know that we will face a very big crisis, perhaps not immediately, but maybe in 5 years, or perhaps in 5 months. Revolutions coincide with crises. How will this crisis deepen in Turkey? What could cause those at the top to become even more unable to govern? You have to ponder these things. You should not postpone the idea of revolution to a period when the revolution is rising. If you don't talk about it now, you will be left behind when the revolution rises; that is the golden rule. Those who prepare for the revolution do justice to the revolution. If you focus on nonsense like 'Is it İmamoğlu or Kılıçdaroğlu, if we get 5 percent more votes...', you cannot do anything. A revolutionary party must speak of revolution and socialism in a period when not even a leaf is moving. It is a skill to say this during this period." 

You cannot foresee the details. You will have foresight regarding why a revolutionary rise might emerge in a country, and you will prepare for it. Your organization will be so strong that you can take the lead when the time comes. They call us very disciplined, overly centralist. Should we not be centralist and instead be like parties that don't act like parties today? We act in a coordinated manner, we act in an organized manner. If one day they try to appoint a trustee to head this party, this party's voice will be singular; we will not give five different answers. We have a direction; if you don't have a direction, you will lose in a revolutionary situation. The moment a revolution begins, it is too late; you cannot make preparations. Whoever makes the right investment wins the revolution."

‘We must expose the hostility toward the Republic within the bosses’

Stating, "They say 'The poor in Turkey are only concerned with their hunger; values like secularism, independence, and republicanism are issues for the middle classes,'" Okuyan continued: "There is only one reality here: the middle classes determine the political and ideological climate of Turkey. This is also true for the Islamist segment. This is normal because the poor classes in Turkey have been excluded from politics. But it is a lie that secularism and patriotism are weak among the poor in Turkey. A segment of the poor in Turkey thinks that the republic is at the root of the rich-poor divide. This is the biggest trick the capitalist class has played on the country. But unfortunately, this perception has taken hold. When you go to Anatolia, there is a hostility toward the rich. They don't see the cult leader stepping out of a Mercedes right next to them, but in their minds, they see the rich having fun on the Bosphorus in Istanbul, and they represent the republic to them. One of our tasks is to bring out the love for the country, republicanism, and secularism that are inherent in the poor people of the Anatolian geography. We must get rid of middle-class secularism. TÜSİAD bosses who praise Mustafa Kemal on November 10ths are doing us great harm. We must expose the hostility toward the republic within the bosses." 

‘Turkey is not only pregnant with a revolution, but it also possesses the resources to carry that revolution to victory’

Kemal Okuyan responded to the question, "Where can a revolution break out?" with the following words: "I am very optimistic in this regard. Turkey is one of the countries closest to a revolution. Latin America is pregnant with revolutions. And there is Russia, a geography close to us. What does it mean to be close to a revolution? There are too many things producing tension in Turkey. Turkey is competing for the top spot in inequality and injustice. If inequality and injustice have peaked in a country, that country is close to a revolution. But that is not enough; are that country's resources sufficient for a revolution? Despite everything, despite the AKP, it is interesting that Turkey is a fertile land. People never run out here. It has plenty of intellectuals. You receive unexpected reactions from points you never expected. Everywhere you look, you see elements that will provide energy in a revolutionary period. You go to the most reactionary settlement in Turkey, and someone takes your arm and gives you morale. Or you go to a government office, and someone writes something inside a file, saying, 'I am also a TKP member.' There is no other country in the world that is this resilient in the middle of such darkness. They cannot consume Turkey." 

The women's volleyball team emerged from this darkness and became world runners-up. The men's basketball team reached the finals. There might be AKP supporters among them; it doesn't matter. They are playing a team game. This country does not hit rock bottom; in one sense we are hitting rock bottom, but this country's resources are very vast. We have a trained workforce, we have our intellectuals, and there is an ambitious Communist Party in this country. Wherever you go in the world, everyone is looking at Turkey out of the corner of their eye. One reason is that Erdoğan is very popular, but there is another reason. Go to the ends of the earth; there is Nâzım Hikmet, and there is Aziz Nesin. You walk down the street, and they say, 'You come from the country of Nâzım Hikmet.' Looking at it from the reverse, it means we are a country that produces both darkness and light. Everyone is looking at Turkey; what will happen in Turkey? There is an idea in the world that despite this darkness, Turkey can change. As long as this society gets out of pessimism. If they asked me to name the 5 countries closest to a revolution, Turkey is one of those 5 countries. I believe this with all my heart. Turkey is not only pregnant with a revolution, but it also possesses the resources to carry that revolution to victory. Turkey is a country that can sustain itself. Therefore, there is no reason to be hopeless."

‘Let this public stop shedding tears for those who have billions of dollars’

Responding to a question regarding a revolutionary party's definition of friend and foe, Okuyan said: "A political movement's first obligation to society is to define friend and foe. The definition of the enemy for the TKP or any communist party is clear. We define 1 percent of Turkish society as the opposition, and we say we have no business with them. This is a fundamental fact. You can divide this society in various ways. The Turkish-Kurdish divide or the Sunni-Alevi divide divides large communities and is dangerous. What will work in the world and save a very large part of the population is the class divide. You leave out a small exploiting class and say we will represent the remaining majority. After declaring this divide, people say, 'This Erdoğan is also bothering the big bosses. He imposes taxes on companies he doesn't like.' Forget these legends. Let this public stop shedding tears for those who have billions of dollars and have stolen terrifyingly large resources from the people; let them think about themselves a little. Neither democracy nor peace will come from them. They are only concerned with keeping their own ships afloat. A party that does not make this distinction is not leftist. There are no capitalists in Turkey's future. If we are going to make this country a secular, independent, and egalitarian country, there will be no capitalist class. You must say this from now on. Perhaps there are very kind-hearted people within big capital, but let's ignore that. Let us focus on the 99 percent." 

‘The whole issue is to establish a capital peace’

Regarding the process referred to as a 'Terror-free Turkey,' Okuyan made the following remarks: "I may update the final chapter of the book in new printings. The final chapter also touches upon the new solution process. The TKP has taken a stance against this process. They said we were anti-Kurdish, they said we wanted terrorism to continue. It has been discussed especially for the last two or three days. The AKP says, 'We have lost huge amounts of money because of terrorism; if we overcome this, the per capita national income will reach 40 thousand dollars.' It doesn't interest me in the slightest. The national income per capita in Turkey is calculated by taking the total and dividing it by the population. The rich get richer, the poor get poorer. Then they give numbers. In reality, they want the top 1 percent to get very rich. A symbol of this is that one of the largest stadiums in Istanbul, the stadium of one of the clubs with the most fans in Turkey, is being named after a Kurdish businessman for the sake of this process. We have no objection to a Kurdish name being given to a place. But we are against Ali Koç, we are against Chobani, we are against Sabancı, and we are against Galatasaray-affiliated businessmen. Why are capitalists putting their stamp on a process in Turkey? Because they will make a profit. The whole issue is to establish a capital peace and exert influence in Syria, exert influence in Iraq, and plunder those places. A solution does not come this way. Since this solution gives nothing to poor people, it has to position itself against the republic. Because the place where they meet is anti-republicanism. There is such a situation on the government front. The Kurdish National Movement has settled on this line; it has a problem with the Republic. We will not say yes to any project led by the capitalist class; we will not stand side by side with the Sheikh Saids, we will not stand side by side with cult leaders. Declaring all Kurds enemies of the republic, declaring all Kurds followers of Sheikh Said is idiocy. Just as not all Turks are republicans—which they are not, there are plenty of counter-revolutionary Turks." 

‘The TKP is a serious party, it will not be a sidekick’

There is a coding among some republicans in Turkey that Kurds are separatists and pro-American. You cannot define any ethnic community or nation this way. They say Kurds are pro-American, yet Turkey has been a NATO member for years. I suppose the Kurdish Nationalist Movement had no hand in Turkey being a NATO member. Citizens of a NATO-member country cannot accuse other citizens of the same country of being pro-American. There are revolutionary Kurds in this country, and there are republican Kurds. Can we establish a unitary, independent socialist country without resorting to identity politics? That is the issue. This is impossible without including the Kurds. Everyone needs to come to their senses. They say, 'There is no Kurd or Turk, we are all Turks,' but that is not the case. If people do not see themselves that way, they do not. We live together in this country. This country has a history. This country has a War of Independence. There are values remaining from that. We need to establish a partnership that will carry those values forward. They went and established a partnership with 1,000 years ago. It must be a joke. Why do they mention Manzikert? To make people forget the Republic, they want to make people forget the War of Independence. Because they want to take revenge. What brings the AKP and the PKK together today is anti-republicanism. We will not be a part of this. The Kurdish issue will not be solved this way; they cannot solve any problem. The TKP is a serious party, it will not be a sidekick. No one will object to the silencing of guns, but the project that will emerge from this will be of no benefit to the poor in Diyarbakır, nor to the poor in Izmir or Istanbul. This process must be handled very carefully. A different line needs to be developed. How will we establish a brotherhood, how will we make our Kurdish citizens, who are about to lose their ties with this country, feel excited about a common foundation? Nationalism breeds nationalism. Nationalism is not a good thing. The claim that one's own nation is superior to other nations is wrong. We are not superior to anyone; we want to make our country superior."

‘Istanbul will be the center of the reckoning’

Okuyan concluded his remarks as follows: "The center of all of Turkey's dynamics is Istanbul. A revolutionary transformation in Turkey cannot happen without establishing hegemony in Istanbul. You may be in control of Istanbul, but if you are not strong in other places, it is not a problem; it will spread. But if you are weak in Istanbul, no matter what you are in other places, the revolution cannot succeed. Istanbul will be the center of the reckoning. But there is a problem. Istanbul has ceased to be the Istanbul of the laborers. Istanbul is a city with many laborers, but these scoundrels have taken control of the city. This must change. Laborers must exert influence on the culture, ideology, and social life of Istanbul. There are major operations. They have wiped out the working-class neighborhoods of Istanbul. They have changed the urban culture. We can take Istanbul back before the revolution. We have no chance of achieving success without doing this. Istanbul will play a central role in the revolution."

Following the talk, many citizens applied to become TKP volunteers at the event where Kemal Okuyan signed his book for readers. The final installment of the ‘How will we bring the country together with revolution’ talks will be held this evening at 19:30 at Çankaya Sahne in Ankara.

News Source: 12punto